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Posts: 136
 
Location: India | Thanks, for some reason I was thinking consecutive letters should be the same if the numbers in the cells are equal.
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Shading and Loops (PR 2016/17) Author
Posts: 62
Location: United States | Puzzle 11: "...it is possible to uniquely restore their contours." Does the assignment of numbers to cards have to be unique, or is it enough to uniquely specify the nine 3x5 borders of the cards? |
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Posts: 172
Location: ITALY | In puzzle 10, I am nut sure whether I can consider a solution as valid if it is the only way of respecting the rules and the clues. Can Riad (or any of the organizers) check the solution I have currently filed and tell me if it is valid and unique?
Edited by forcolin 2020-04-10 7:49 AM
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Posts: 136
Location: India | Puzzle 10: Is this a town puzzle with 2x2 white areas not permissible? Or the white strips must be 1XN when evaluating the score? There is no clear demarcation in the description between puzzle rules and score evaluation. |
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Location: India | Updated Puzzle Booklet
An updated version of the Puzzle Booklet is available now.
Changes:
Puzzle 9 : Example fixed
Puzzle 10: Rules updated
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Moscow Puzzle Cup 2016 Author
Posts: 234
Location: Russia | WA1729 - 2020-04-10 12:27 AM
Puzzle 11: "...it is possible to uniquely restore their contours." Does the assignment of numbers to cards have to be unique, or is it enough to uniquely specify the nine 3x5 borders of the cards?
The reviewer should clearly define the borders of the nine cards and their numerical values. |
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Moscow Puzzle Cup 2016 Author
Posts: 234
Location: Russia | forcolin - 2020-04-10 7:29 AM
In puzzle 10, I am nut sure whether I can consider a solution as valid if it is the only way of respecting the rules and the clues. Can Riad (or any of the organizers) check the solution I have currently filed and tell me if it is valid and unique?
I was sent your solution, it is not valid. Some rectangles that you were supposed to declare dark can be declared completely white. You need to get a solution without 2x2 white fragments. You use this condition as given in advance. This is incorrect. |
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Posts: 26
Location: Ukraine | Puzzle 7.
For numbers with cells, the use of rules a) OR b) is true. If there is a cell where the rules are applied a) AND b) is this true or is it wrong? |
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Posts: 55
Location: India | In the town puzzle mini example, going by the definition of a street being a stretch of white cells of length 2 and width 1, I can make out 6 streets in the solution for it. But the answer key gives it as 4, so have i understood it wrong?Or is there a mistake in the example's key? |
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Posts: 136
Location: India | Someone kindly rephrase that answer, as I cannot understand any of it. I have already submitted a solution and I am pretty sure I understand what is expected. But, this new piece of information makes me believe that I may still be missing something though it is very unlikely. Organizers, either confirm that my solution follows the rules, or please confirm what is mentioned in that last reply by the author.
A slightly larger example grid might clear any doubts ( "You use this condition as given in advance" - he meant 'used' OR 'need to use'). The language seems to be the source of all confusion here. Reviewers have to step up their efforts.
Edited by anurag 2020-04-11 2:34 PM
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Posts: 136
Location: India | Count only those strips that are bounded by edges or rectangles. Example is fine. |
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Posts: 136
Location: India | Anderson: Interesting. I wonder how the two things you mentioned are different. In my opinion, when one of the two is met, the other is too, automatically (note that I am not starting to solve this puzzle yet so I am not thinking enough). Perhaps I am missing something.
Secondly, I am not sure if your query (and the authors' reply) were from the answer key standpoint or the solve itself. If you noticed, the example's answer key does not include any 'numerical assignment' whatever that means.
Uniquely restoring could just require that the grid be cut uniquely with no more than one assignment (which equates to card placement, and hence I don't see why the two things are separate) possible.
Lastly, if indeed, as Riad mentions, the competitor (or reviewer as he calls it) has to specify the borders, how are we supposed to do it? There is no such assistance provided with the instructions. And did the reviewers ('reviewers' here means reviewers, not competitors) miss mentioning that in the file?
Edited by anurag 2020-04-11 4:25 PM
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Posts: 67
Location: France | Hello everyone, Hello Riad,
I am extremely happy to face this contest again, which is for me the best event of the year!
And yet, because of the confinement, I forgot that it was the period and I missed the start. Why didn't you remind us earlier in a post that the start was coming? I'm really disappointed for that ...
Take care of you all. |
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Posts: 8
Location: Japan | Puzzle 10:
I think the definition of "streets" is ambiguous.
To clarify the definition, I consider a following 7x7 example:
~~~~##~
~##~##~
~##~##~
~~~~~~~
###~##~
###~##~
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~ means white cell and # means dark cell.
I guess there are 6 streets in this grid.
detail:
R1C1 -> R1C4
R4C1 -> R4C7
R7C4 -> R7C7
R1C1 -> R4C1
R1C4 -> R7C4
R1C7 -> R7C7
Is this interpretation correct? |
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Posts: 2
Location: Japan | Puzzle 10: I have a question about the sentence "The white cells must form streets. The white area of the streets cannot contain fragments of 2x2 cells."
Is this the rule of a Town puzzle or the restriction on answers (in this case, a Town puzzle is the same as a so-called Clouds puzzle)?
For example, the mini-example without "2" is valid or invalid? |
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Posts: 136
Location: India | panista - 2020-04-11 5:28 PM
Puzzle 10: I have a question about the sentence "The white cells must form streets. The white area of the streets cannot contain fragments of 2x2 cells."
Is this the rule of a Town puzzle or the restriction on answers (in this case, a Town puzzle is the same as a so-called Clouds puzzle)?
For example, the mini-example without "2" is valid or invalid?
I had asked the same question in an earlier post. Obviously, this restriction has to be a part of the Town puzzle and not just the answer entry, as otherwise it would make the puzzle trivial. However, the phrase "The white area of the streets cannot contain fragments of 2x2 cells" confused me as it was incorrectly stated. The reviewers should make some effort to rephrase it to "The white area cannot contain fragments of 2x2 cells".
But, it remains to be seen what the organizers confirm. |
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Moscow Puzzle Cup 2016 Author
Posts: 234
Location: Russia | Mihalich - 2020-04-10 11:36 PM
Puzzle 7.
For numbers with cells, the use of rules a) OR b) is true. If there is a cell where the rules are applied a) AND b) is this true or is it wrong?
If both a) and b) can be applied, you can choose any of them. |
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Moscow Puzzle Cup 2016 Author
Posts: 234
Location: Russia | pranavmanu - 2020-04-11 12:21 PM
In the town puzzle mini example, going by the definition of a street being a stretch of white cells of length 2 and width 1, I can make out 6 streets in the solution for it. But the answer key gives it as 4, so have i understood it wrong?Or is there a mistake in the example's key?
In the example, there are 4 streets with a length of 4 cells each. |
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Moscow Puzzle Cup 2016 Author
Posts: 234
Location: Russia | anurag - 2020-04-11 2:30 PM
Someone kindly rephrase that answer, as I cannot understand any of it. I have already submitted a solution and I am pretty sure I understand what is expected. But, this new piece of information makes me believe that I may still be missing something though it is very unlikely. Organizers, either confirm that my solution follows the rules, or please confirm what is mentioned in that last reply by the author.
A slightly larger example grid might clear any doubts ( "You use this condition as given in advance" - he meant 'used' OR 'need to use'). The language seems to be the source of all confusion here. Reviewers have to step up their efforts.
Take a look at an example of the Town puzzle. Let's delete the given digit 2. Stefano assumed that the solution would be with a dark square. But the verifier (Deb or I) can declare the middle of the example white. The digit 2 is necessary for the uniqueness of the solution. |
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Moscow Puzzle Cup 2016 Author
Posts: 234
Location: Russia | Puzlifouk - 2020-04-11 5:03 PM
Hello everyone, Hello Riad,
I am extremely happy to face this contest again, which is for me the best event of the year!
And yet, because of the confinement, I forgot that it was the period and I missed the start. Why didn't you remind us earlier in a post that the start was coming? I'm really disappointed for that ...
Take care of you all.
Thank you for your kind words! |
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Moscow Puzzle Cup 2016 Author
Posts: 234
Location: Russia | SP1 - 2020-04-11 5:12 PM
Puzzle 10:
I think the definition of "streets" is ambiguous.
To clarify the definition, I consider a following 7x7 example:
~~~~##~
~##~##~
~##~##~
~~~~~~~
###~##~
###~##~
###~~~~
~ means white cell and # means dark cell.
I guess there are 6 streets in this grid.
detail:
R1C1 -> R1C4
R4C1 -> R4C7
R7C4 -> R7C7
R1C1 -> R4C1
R1C4 -> R7C4
R1C7 -> R7C7
Is this interpretation correct?
Correct! |
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Moscow Puzzle Cup 2016 Author
Posts: 234
Location: Russia | panista - 2020-04-11 5:28 PM
Puzzle 10: I have a question about the sentence "The white cells must form streets. The white area of the streets cannot contain fragments of 2x2 cells."
Is this the rule of a Town puzzle or the restriction on answers (in this case, a Town puzzle is the same as a so-called Clouds puzzle)?
For example, the mini-example without "2" is valid or invalid?
Without the digit 2, the example does not have a unique solution. |
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Posts: 55
Location: India | Riad Khanmagomedov - 2020-04-11 5:55 PM
Take a look at an example of the Town puzzle. Let's delete the given digit 2. Stefano assumed that the solution would be with a dark square. But the verifier (Deb or I) can declare the middle of the example white. The digit 2 is necessary for the uniqueness of the solution.
But the rules of the puzzle state no 2*2 area can be completely white, which ensures that middle of the mini example has to be a 2*2 block of shaded cells!!,based on the other 0 clues. They cant be taken as white as that is not even a solution in the first place.I dont see how uniqueness comes into the picture here?? How is the outside clue 2 essential as per the rules?
Also, going by your statement,every row or column that has shaded cells should be clued with an outside digit, or else they will be assumed by you as white?
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Posts: 136
Location: India | Prnav: That's the whole point! If you read my first query regarding this puzzle, it was there to verify the same thing, whether the 2x2 constraint has to be considered during the design (and I am sure it has to be). But now, the author's statement implies NOT. Which is surprising. Apparently nice and easy puzzle, but so much discussion surrounding it. |
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Posts: 11
Location: Indonesia | Puzzle 10:
I'm pretty confident about my understanding of puzzle 10, so I may rephrase the definition of streets as: "if you treat the final board as a crossword, then the street is a single word, so the number of street will be the number of words in this crossword."
And also, I have to agree that without 2 in the example, the solution should be unique as there shouldn't be any 2x2 of white cells. The proposed "alternative solution" fails this constraint.
This is my opinion btw, surely it will be great for the organizers to clarify this. |
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Riad Khanmagomedov's April Contest — 8th to 18th April 2020
