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SM 2020 (Math) Author
Posts: 419
Location: India | and in symmetric unequal what does cells 180deg symmetric to each other mean..????totally blank....could not make out head or tail out of it...kindly explain guys.. |
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Diagonal Vision Author
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Location: Switzerland | The queen sudoku of diagonal vision's instructions booklet is a bit too hard... It's my fault.
We discussed about it there: http://logicmastersindia.com/forum/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=451&s...
Fred |
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Diagonal Vision Author
Posts: 337
Location: Switzerland | kishy72 - 2012-10-23 7:02 PM
and in symmetric unequal what does cells 180deg symmetric to each other mean..????totally blank....could not make out head or tail out of it...kindly explain guys..
R1C1 is symmetric to R9C9, R1C2 is symmetric to R9C8, R2C1 symmetric to R8C9, etc... does it help?
Fred |
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SM 2020 (Math) Author
Posts: 419
Location: India |
So i am not the only one stuck it seems! But Beautiful theme nevertheless....similar to what u do in a chess game.......think ahead and see if it is advisable to go with that continuation...perhaps thats why this sudoku is rightly named queen sudoku....i was looking for a logical continuation....did not look for a contradiction at all.... |
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SM 2020 (Math) Author
Posts: 419
Location: India | Fred76 - 2012-10-23 7:25 PM
kishy72 - 2012-10-23 7:02 PM
and in symmetric unequal what does cells 180deg symmetric to each other mean..????totally blank....could not make out head or tail out of it...kindly explain guys..
R1C1 is symmetric to R9C9, R1C2 is symmetric to R9C8, R2C1 symmetric to R8C9, etc... does it help?
Fred
So going by the same logic R5C1 is symmetric to R5C9 ,R5C2 is symmetric to R5C8 etc...and the only cell symmetric to itself in the entire grid is R5C5...?! |
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Location: India | kishy72 - 2012-10-23 7:45 PM
So going by the same logic R5C1 is symmetric to R5C9 ,R5C2 is symmetric to R5C8 etc...and the only cell symmetric to itself in the entire grid is R5C5...?!
That is correct. Now all the additional rule says is "If two different cells are 1800 symmetric to each other, they must contain different digits".
More examples: mock12 IB & PB - http://logicmastersindia.com/lmitests/?test=mock12
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SM 2020 (Math) Author
Posts: 419
Location: India | not able to touch the solution in this untouchable sudoku....cells with same digits dont touch diagonally..first sudoku of this variant which i had tried ...where am i missing the trick here?
Edited by kishy72 2012-10-29 11:01 PM
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Diagonal Vision Author
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Location: Switzerland | kishy72 - 2012-10-29 11:00 PM
not able to touch the solution in this untouchable sudoku....cells with same digits dont touch diagonally..first sudoku of this variant which i had tried ...where am i missing the trick here?
Kishy: BE CAREFUL NOT TO POST THE SUDOKUS OF A COMPETITION BEFORE IT IS FINISHED !
The competition is now finished, but it was not the case when you posted this one.
That being said, try to place the 2 in row 5, and then you can place lot of other digits 
Fred |
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Location: India | Fred76 - 2012-10-30 4:32 AM
Kishy: BE CAREFUL NOT TO POST THE SUDOKUS OF A COMPETITION BEFORE IT IS FINISHED !
The competition is now finished, but it was not the case when you posted this one.
Kishy72, Consider this as your first and last warning. Never post puzzles from LMI / other sites while the competition is running. Always wait for few hours after the competition ends. |
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SM 2020 (Math) Author
Posts: 419
Location: India | Fred76 - 2012-10-30 4:32 AM
kishy72 - 2012-10-29 11:00 PM
not able to touch the solution in this untouchable sudoku....cells with same digits dont touch diagonally..first sudoku of this variant which i had tried ...where am i missing the trick here?
Kishy: BE CAREFUL NOT TO POST THE SUDOKUS OF A COMPETITION BEFORE IT IS FINISHED !
The competition is now finished, but it was not the case when you posted this one.
That being said, try to place the 2 in row 5, and then you can place lot of other digits
Fred
BE CAREFUL NOT TO POST THE SUDOKUS OF A COMPETITION BEFORE IT IS FINISHED
This thought did cross to me immediately after i had posted it but i left it at that thinking that the person had just as much a chance of going wrong as getting it correct by seeing this sudoku but anyway i know that that is not the point.It wont occur again. |
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SM 2020 (Math) Author
Posts: 419
Location: India | Administrator - 2012-10-30 8:48 AM
Fred76 - 2012-10-30 4:32 AM
Kishy: BE CAREFUL NOT TO POST THE SUDOKUS OF A COMPETITION BEFORE IT IS FINISHED !
The competition is now finished, but it was not the case when you posted this one.
Kishy72, Consider this as your first and last warning. Never post puzzles from LMI / other sites while the competition is running. Always wait for few hours after the competition ends.
You could have removed my post instead of admonishing me like this or you could have said to me in private before u posted this.This looks like slapping me in the face and saying 'Dont post sudokus in this forum'.I m not a fugitive under warrant |
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2021 World Sudoku+Puzzle Convention Organizer
Posts: 1809
Location: India | kishy72 - 2012-10-30 10:33 AM
You could have removed my post instead of admonishing me like this or you could have said to me in private before u posted this.This looks like slapping me in the face and saying 'Dont post sudokus in this forum'.I m not a fugitive under warrant
Well you'll have to be to solve the next test :P Anyway, in all seriousness, what you are doing(posting on forum and asking doubts) is great. In fact we've been encouraging beginners to do that for some time now. Its just that, when something like this happens, we need to make sure it doesn't happen again through anyone, not just you. I think that was the reason for the public warning. Do be careful in the future :) |
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Posts: 13
Location: Germany | I just wanted to say a quick Thank You for the tricks I've learned only on these 2 pages. I have never looked for triplets in a puzzle! This is the next way to go! Thank you very much! |
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Posts: 13
Location: Germany | http://i46.tinypic.com/14yba10.jpg
I have had trouble seeing a way to solve this puzzle completely avoiding trial and error. Can someone please help me? |
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Posts: 13
Location: Germany | I tried to fit it rigth into the post, but it was rather big.
Edited by purzelbaumfan 2013-03-29 4:59 PM
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2021 World Sudoku+Puzzle Convention Organizer
Posts: 1809
Location: India | I can proceed further by seeing that 5 in Row 7 put in either place puts 7 in R7C4, which can be seen using row 4 for one placement of 5, and the other is pretty straightforward. There's another sticking point in proving that R9C2 can't be 4 (4-5 in the 7th box means 5 must be in R4C2, where'll 7 go in C2?). Its pretty difficult, but thats the closest I can come to a solid path. |
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Posts: 13
Location: Germany | Thank you very much. That was a very decent solving path without trying too much. I appreciate your help. |
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Posts: 13
Location: Germany | This is another puzzle I didn't get any further with. Any suggestions?
Edited by purzelbaumfan 2013-03-30 10:08 PM
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2021 World Sudoku+Puzzle Convention Organizer
Posts: 1809
Location: India | There's a way to eliminate 4 from R5C6 (It then goes in R7C5 and eliminates both possibilities in column 8!). Also, only 4/8 can be in R9C9 because of R7C5, which means one of 4/8 in Row 7 is in C8/9, so R7C6 is 3/9 only. After that, I could prove that R9C4 cannot be a 3 by just using 3s and 9s and seeing the crowd-out that happens in R1C9. But this last step's bordering on guessing, so I'm not sure if thats the intended path. |
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Posts: 13
Location: Germany | Thank you. I have managed to solve some other puzzles of the "extreme" level. Now I tried a "hardcore" one and I can't get any further. I don't even know where to start a chain! What do you say?
Edited by purzelbaumfan 2013-04-03 11:34 PM
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Posts: 199
Location: United States | I'd wager I've never met a person who can solve that puzzle logically or even deduce 1 digit before guessing. I'd even say I've yet to even find a computer solver that can do it -- One solver completely stopped without any digits and the other required a lot of Bowman's Bingos which are essentially guesses.
You can probably check some of these puzzles out this way too. I recommend plugging them into sudokuwiki.org/sudoku.htm which can quickly evaluate the next step at a point when you get stuck.
Can I ask what book this is that is publishing such crazy puzzles? |
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Posts: 13
Location: Germany | I sometimes put sudokus into the solver you recommended. But it still is a computer and some of the strategies are just way over the top and too funky. The last times I posted puzzles in here it was the same way: I first put them into the sudoku solver to see what it had to say, and then I put it in here. I found that the "human solutions" were always better to understand and there were still some nice tricks about it.
Unfortunately, this time I didn't bother to put it into the solver because I was sure it would give me extraordinary strategies I'd never use again.
The book is Nr. 31 from Stefan Heine: http://www.ps-heine.de/archives/1037
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SM 2020 (Math) Author
Posts: 419
Location: India | With the Sudoku Caravan moving next to the UK and then the US in a short notice i thought it would be appropriate now to get the unworked worked out.So after a bit of an exile from this stuck forum (which was more self imposed) i m back to being stuck again .So this is going to be the first of the three 'Big Fish sudokus' that i m going to post.This movable digits sudoku looked like a fun puzzle to solve until the point i got stuck from where it became suddenly 'immovable' and made me to call it quits.So fellas can you find the continuation and shw the way to me?
Edited by kishy72 2013-04-25 8:40 PM
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Location: The Netherlands | To start, look at where the 3 can go in R2. It will give you a few placements. To not ruin the rest of the solve, i'll let you try to solve it from this point. If there's another sticking point, just show where you're at after this.
Edited by Para 2013-04-25 9:05 PM
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SM 2020 (Math) Author
Posts: 419
Location: India | Hi !!Thnks for the nice tip .I was able to proceed from there till here.I see that this stage is ripe for a bifurcation where the numbers will rapidly fall in place after that but i was looking for the logical continuation and the right line of thinking has eluded me for close to 45mins from this point.How do i continue from here?!
Edited by kishy72 2013-04-27 11:26 PM
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stuck in this sudoku
